Tom, thank you for that very kind offer. Not sure if I will take you up on it, I'm too afraid of what I might discover (see Pistolcat's hilarious take on it above). Ignorance might be bliss for the financially challenged.
All kidding aside, you are a helluva businessman/salesman though as your story and offer compelled me to visit your website, something I otherwise wouldn't have done.
One thing I would like to ask you, your custom harps all appear to have double reedplates and combs made from exotic materials. Does that actually aid in improved performance or is it just for aesthetics? And if so how?
Edited to correct: possibly not all Tom's harps are double reedplated just the ones on the first page. Correct me if I'm wrong about that.
Also, a question I'd like to throw out to anyone. Where would one start (a complete and utter neophyte that is) in trying to adjust their harmonicas for better bending? I haven't so much as opened up a single harp, which I guess makes me "limited" according to Michelle and "dumb-lazy" according to Pistolcat. It's cool, I'll own it. That said, is there a consensus on where a limited, dumb-lazy player like me would go for guidance on this? Stop laughing, harp players can reach a consensus on some things...maybe...once in a while...every leapyear.
Edited to add: nevermind that last paragraph, the instructional videos/websites are all over the place for that topic, so no need to chime in.
Last Edited by Honkin On Bobo on Jul 14, 2016 8:38 AM
Hahahaha! Brick you're the best. Exposing my true laziness, I guess I could have googled that, huh? OK, so the guy shows the mechanics of what to do, take the covers off stick a toothpick in there (which by the way, if it is actually that easy then I really have to own the lazy label), but which reed and what type of adjustment wider or narrower? I know he says it depends on your playing style, but what the hell does that mean?
For example if I'm having trouble with bends on 2 and 3 of a given harp, which reeds torqued which way?
Last Edited by Honkin On Bobo on Jul 14, 2016 7:32 AM
This has been a very interesting thread. There is something very "Yin and Yang" about it. A harmonica is a simple and inexpensive implement that can be easily used for musical expression and yet, it is a musical instrument and part of music is striving for perfection. This is the very nature of music itself, it can be simple and spontaneous, or a highly orchestrated effort. Whether you pluck a blade of grass and stretch it across you lips to may a joyful tune, or prefer an instrument with built with the time treasure and care than you put into the development of your musical skills, keep making music, and feel free to enjoy the music made in styles not your own.
PS. For those of you who do make music with blades of grass, I am sure you are of two camps. One camp reveling in the simplicity and availability of grass and leaves for making music, and the other astounded that one would not take the time to learn how to select and care for the best species of plants for making music at a higher level. :-)
Pistolcat - I am glad to hear that you are getting a harp from Joel. That's awesome.
Bobo - with regard to the harps I build, most are not double reed plate harps. Most are regular harps using my custom combs. The Special 20 is by far my biggest seller, but I also sell plenty of Marine Bands, Golden Melodys and Manjis.
There are a ton of videos on Youtube about adjusting gaps. The thing to remember is that reeds are little springs. They are very resilient. You need to be gentle but they are not butterfly wings. I can promise you that once you learn how to gap your reeds and see the improvement it makes on your harps you will wonder why you waited so long to do it. Best of luck, and my offer still stands. ---------- Tom Halchak www.BlueMoonHarmonicas.com
Bobo, I have found that most harps that have a problem have one or two reeds see too high and when you take the covers off and look at them, it is obvious. Just seting the out of place reeds to be more in line with the others will frequently improve the harp greatly. As you set the reeds close to the reed plates, bending becomes easier, but if you set them too close, they may choke on you when you don't want them too. This is where the personal preference comes in. If you are skilled enough to prevent choking on close set reeds, you may want the extra bending ease of close reeds. If you are constantly having reeds choke on you, you might open the gaps and loose a bit of the ease of bending.
Thanks Tom. Yeah I just googled the topic and there is certainly no shortage of instructionals, so that's on me for attempting to waste anybody's time. Appreciate your insight though, thanks.
STME - thanks appreciate that.
Last Edited by Honkin On Bobo on Jul 14, 2016 8:40 AM
First of all I love custom harmonicas and I love all of the great custom combs being made. I don't think most of you guys lived thru the Hohner bad years. You needed to "muscle" harps to get them to do what you needed them to do. A lot of harps sound is from the player. This is an old cut using a cheap harp. Some of the sound is how it's recorded but the mic was a flat response akg dm 500 ----------
So how much better would Little Walter be with a custom harp, They must help a good player attack with more control.But they will never play the caliber of L.W. I have been playing since `68 and have been adjusting reeds all the time, that's enough for me.but if some one plays better with all the adjustments avalabile more power to them. I think that there should be more fantastic players with these custom harps,there isn`t.
Bobo, no shortage of instructions aren't necessarily a good thing choppa joe has a extensive series on the subject that is gold standard, imho. I tried to copy that my first harps. Nowadays I'm lazy and just take the covers off and CLOSE all gaps some. The closer the gaps are the more responsive, easier to bend, overbend, blowbend it'll get. Too close and it will choke on you, especially when playing hard.
So if you have problems with hole two and three then I'd suggest that you gap those holes, both draw and blow reeds, and leave the rest. Leave the reed plates on and make small adjustments and test the reeds a lot. Just hold the cover plates on and put the screws back when you have finished. I guarantee that your harps will play nicer with some gap adjustments. If you get any problems you can take up on toms offer or better; see someone in person that can show you what I'm talking about!
Crossovers, +35 years of serious playing and they really have been a glorious thing. I've never owned a custom and this thread adds up to a fact (for me) that I'd seriously enjoy a custom. I do gap drill sand and even emboss but only seem to be decent at gapping. Tuning drives me a little crazy - any favorite videos on tuning would be appreciated.
I like both Richard Sleigh's and Andrew Zajac's videos on tuning. Both accentuate the use of their proprietary tools. I have both tools sets and they are both high quality and work as advertised.
I would characterize the tech's approaches to their tools and their methods as being a more classic approach (Richard) and a fresh, innovative approach (Andrew). They are equally valid and proven ways to think about tuning and the tools used to perform it and they are complementary. Kinja Pollard has some great videos but he's gone of the deep end, concentrating on Dick Sjoeberg's $400 tuning table. Unaffordable for me.
Richard's videos aren't all free like Andrew's but they are extensive and highly detailed. I like Andrew's tools for their simplicity and his approach to tuning for its innovative thinking and common sensibility. I use a combination of Richard's and Andrew's scraper tuning tools as well as a sanding wand and a precision rotary tool with polishing pins or diamond burrs for removing material. It all depends on how much material needs to be removed and where.
Michelle, your last post brought a new idea into my awareness:
You play "expensive" custom harps, customized by YOU!
You are a harp tech!!!
You have sought out customization techniques from different acknowledged techs, acquired tools, and have practiced the necessary skills to optimize your own harmonicas to fit your style of playing. You eschew the extra steps needed to facilitate overbending, since you don't base your playing on overbends and don't care for the higher overtones that go with setting up a harp that way. You have the patience and methodical approach that supports your efforts.
Your thoughts in this thread seem much more understandable to me after this revelation. The product that is being demonstrated doesn't seem all that special, and you don't like the sound of an overblow harp, anyway. It is not rocket science. And there clearly are issues of lack of scientific validity in self testing a product in a comparison demo.
Given the premium prices on customized harps, I understand why the demo did not impress you. To you, it is not a big deal to modify a harp to play better. When someone markets a custom harp with a price that includes the cost of the tools and the time invested to develop the knowledge and skills needed, as well as time working on the specific harp, it just does not seem appropriate to you. After all, with a little work and time you can make your harps play great. Not all of us have the aptitude and motivation to develop our skills to the extent that you have.
Unless I were going to pursue full chromaticism on a diatonic (I am not), I also find the price of custom overbend harps too high for me, though I understand the pricing. Initially the brightness of these harps stood out for me, but that goes with an embossed harp, and I have become used to hearing it. Crossovers OOTB are brighter than the old Marine Bands, because they are built to tighter tolerances similar to lower level custom MBs, though not embossed.
I am an adequate dabbler in harp improvement/adjustment for myself, and you, taken in the bigger picture of those people who work on harps to a greater extent, fit the category of "harp tech". You may not take it as far as some, since you are not building OB harps, but you qualify to fit the set of customizers.
You go considerably beyond adjusting gaps when you work on your harps, so you don't see why a custom harp is considered such a big deal, or why they are priced so high. ----------
"...and double check which reed you ~think~ you are working on...". Yes, that's it. Gotta focus. I know I can't even turn on the radio or I'll be in the wrong place tuning the wrong way. Thank you!
Doug, thank you for articulating my perspective. You not not only did a better job than I could but you've caused me to take a closer look at myself before I make another comment that goes against the mainstream. You have pointed the mirror at me and helped me to understand why my comments were so incendiary. I admit to being a bit mystified.
Now I realize that I neglected to add a proviso explaining where I was coming from to my original dissenting comment. I forget that everyone on MBH doesn't know me. You are absolutely correct on these key points. 1. I've spent a lot of time and money over the last 15 years accumulating the reference material, knowledge, skill set and tools to modify and maintain my own harmonicas. When I started on my harmonica journey there were few professional customizers and those were unreachable by mere mortals like me. I'm an engineer with machine shop skills and it is second nature to me to learn how to take apart a harmonica and modify it. 2. I reached a high enough level of confidence that I've been offering my repair and customization services to local and regional harmonica players for about 5 years. I'll emboss, arc and scribe as necessary to make my customers overbend-capable, but... 3. I don't use overbends myself and dislike what the necessary changes do to the timbre of my favorite instrument. 4. I am retired and time is on my side for once in my life. I can and do spend as much time as I like working on harmonicas. I've never logged my time when I work on a harp. I work until I'm finished. I'm sure that as an astute businessman Joel keeps a time clock.
So it is difficult for me to gauge both the actual value of a highly customized harmonica or their potential impact on the wide spectrum of players on this list. My comments were made strictly from my own perspective and as you have so rightly pointed out, it is one that is rather skewed. From where I sit as a non-overbender the extra effort to make a harp overbend-friendly actually detracts from their value as a player -- for me. I tell myself that I must not be the only one who feels that way but this thread is causing me to rethink that. However I do feel that some of the backlash I saw was rooted in my bluntness and my failure to issue a proviso or caveat explaining myself more fully.
Joel came into this thread from a very different perspective than me. He was obviously celebrating his technical achievements and probably, just like me from the opposite view, assumed that it would be obvious to all how superior a highly customized harmonica sounds compared to unmodified models. I rained on his parade without fully explaining why I said what I did. In that respect, I suppose I was being a bit disingenuous to Joel and the forum.
So in this new light I do apologize to Joel and the forum at large. I'll be more careful next time. I am not changing my mind but would have shared it more fully in a more explanatory way.
Thanks a lot Doug for shedding this new light on my own forum behavior. I was blind but now I see.
Michelle
---------- SilverWing Leather - Custom leather creations for musicians and other eccentrics.
I received 2 customized harp last Saturday from Joe Spears. They are definitely the best playing harps I have in my kit. My previous best players included Suzuki Firebreath and Seydel Noble harps with minor reed adjustment, so the bar is set pretty high.
As I have learned to overblow, I have found that some of my harps overblow well on some holes. What I have found with the Spiers harps is that all of the overblows and overdraws on both harps work as well as the best of my current harp so I no longer have to decide whether I want the harp the 5 OB works on or the one the 6OB works on. I was hoping for a big improvement in ability to overblow with these harps, but I see I am going to have to work for that.
What I really notice about these harps is an increase in response at very low airflow. This allows me to play quietly with control. The consistency from hole to hole allows me to maintain a very low volume without some notes dropping out. I also find these harps muck easier to control the draw bends on, especially at low volume. The ability to play softy gives me a larger dynamic range. When using amplification this range can be moved up and down, but having a large dynamic range allows much more expression in playing. Drastic changes in volume can help to hold an audiences interest, or get their attention.
As with almost anything, the rule of diminishing returns is at work here. The difference between a $5 Blues Band and a $40 Special 20 is greater than the difference between a $100 Firebreath and a $180 custom. Whether the expensive custom is worth it or not, is a very personal decision. I am sure I will be buying more as my budget allows.
The more you use a custom harp, the more you get forced to refine EVERYTHING about your playing technique, and that includes everything from breath control, dynamics, and you now see how little breath you need to do absolutely anything you want. Actual breaking in of a harp largely not necessary but in truth, you're finding out that it's the player that needs to be broken into the instrument. Since you have an instrument that is fully set up properly for the overblow technique, it's a far cry from anything OOTB. Now the thing to remember is that unlike anything OOTB, the instrument is now a LIFETIME instrument and rather than buying a new harp or a new set of reed plates, you just send the instrument back to Joe Spiers, or whoever the customizer may be, and all they have to do is replace the individual reed and then set just that reed up alone to match the rest of the instrument, so in many ways it's similar to what you do with horns or guitars (and who in the hell is gonna throw out a guitar just because you broke a string??). ---------- Sincerely, Barbeque Bob Maglinte Boston, MA http://www.barbequebob.com CD available at http://www.cdbaby.com/cd/bbmaglinte
Tom Sez: "...unlike anything OOTB, the instrument is now a LIFETIME instrument and rather than buying a new harp or a new set of reed plates, you just send the instrument back to Joe Spiers, or whoever the customizer may be..."
I say: Or, think about learning to work on your own harps. It isn't rocket science. The time and money invested in appropriate tools and learning resources will pay themselves back manifold times over a few harps. Andrew offers the tools at very affordable prices and all the free video instruction and email support you'll need to use them effectively.
Start with his Basic and Reed Replacement Tool Kits and a $20 guitar tuner and for ~$100 (and a little practice) you're replacing and tuning your own reeds.
At least that's the way I see it.
Michelle
---------- SilverWing Leather - Custom leather creations for musicians and other eccentrics.
